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May 04, 2025, 21:44:04 pm

Author Topic: New prop  (Read 3373 times)

jasonli

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New prop
« on: August 01, 2004, 23:53:05 pm »
I have read many reviews by all of you regarding prop type, pitch, blade #... I would like a greater hole shot and dont mind sacrificing a bit of top speed. Whats the final word on the prop to have for an S22? I usually run 1400lbs plus folks.

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Re:New prop
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2004, 00:42:54 am »
IMHO, there is no final word on the S22/SX. The final word for the E/X is Acme 3-blade 13"x11.5"

That same prop on an S22/SX looks like it might still be overpropped (as evidenced by apparently not reaching redline). I hadn't thought we had a good GPS reading on that speed. If/when we do, I'd assume we're probably gonna want to prop down even further so that the v-drive is 'properly-propped', ie. WOT gets to 6KRPM.
Derek Boyer
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jasonli

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Re:New prop
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2004, 05:40:35 am »
what is the specs on the factory prop? I had my boat weighed down today with people / ballast and she was laborin' to get on plane. Would ski masters know about this?

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Re:New prop
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2004, 17:57:13 pm »
Factory props were OJ Nibral 3- or 4-blade 13"x13" but I'm not sure of their cup. The factory props were correct diameter/pitch for the direct drives, but were a couple hundred rpm too much for the v-drives. The new CNC props outperform the old school cast nibrals and stainless props.

Go ahead and talk to them Ski Masters.
Derek Boyer
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Bitzco

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Re:New prop
« Reply #4 on: August 21, 2004, 03:38:12 am »
I never had a concern about props until I read all the prop info posted here lately. I have a 2001 SX-22 that I bought used.  Today I checked speed and Wide open throttle RPM. Wide open I was only at 4900 rpm and about 34 mph. The thing could pull stumps, but It seems from what I've read that I'm not maxing out on the boat's potential. The current prop is a 4 blade stainless and says 13 X 13 1/2 LH. With the boat, the provious owner also gave me a prop and prop puller. It must be the original prop with a date of 7/01 stamped on it. It is a 13 X 13 LH OJ and is not stainless (I don't know what that sort of brassish material is). I looked at the V-Drive and there is a tag attached to it with serial number and stuff and the ratio 1:1.46. Lend me your expertise Toyota owners. Should I switch back to the original prop? Should I get an ACME (If so, which one)? I'm not very technically minded, an engineer, or even a mechanic, so I'd appreciate any input you have.
03 Pilot, 01 Epic SX, 330 cc bombers and 4 kids in back. Working to retire to a lakeside cottage with my own boat dock.

brad

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Re:New prop
« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2004, 14:15:05 pm »
I assume your performance is impacted by elevation (4,500 feet above sea level here in Utah).

I've never maxed my 2002 SX out to see the top end.  I'll try to do it the next time out - I'll probably be at Deer Creek (6,500 feet) and I'll report back.
Brad

2002 Epic SX

phenom_1819

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Re:New prop
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2004, 01:35:06 am »
I know nothing about this, so don't have much to bring to the conversation.  But I'm really good at bashing Ski Masters!  Jason, I might be beating a dead horse by continuing to bring this up, but take what anything and everything they say with a grain of salt. Keep in mind, their service guy is brand new and is completely unfamiliar with Toyota's (but he'll tell you he knows everything!).

I try to go to Ski Masters only when I have to.  I never have gone to them voluntarily (only for a few visits for warranty stuff).  There is more much good information and good advice on this site than you will ever get out of Ski Masters.  Therefore, I'd go with the Acme that Brent has on his X22, because that seems to be the best prop, and it's tried and tested on real Toyotas.

I'll betcha the service guys at Ski Masters have never even heard of Acme.

Anyway, just my (uninvited) two cents...again...

:)
Cal
Yakima, WA
Previous owner of 2001 Toyota Epic X22

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Re:New prop
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2004, 05:09:05 am »
Bitzco, your MPH and RPM numbers sound awful, especially for a (well) fuel injected engine. If you were to prop for that altitude, I'm sure you could do much better, but of course, you'd be underpropped when you head down to Powell - your choice. I'm gonna plead ignorance like Cal (except my claim is justified ;-) It does look like your gear ratio is different than mine (mine's closer to 1.25:1), so I'd expect you to have a different pitch on your prop. How much? Don't know, but the fact that you're at such a low speed AND low rpm indicates to me that you're pushing too much prop for the conditions. Not a little too much, a LOT. If you're at 4900 now, you've left 1100 on the table, and altitude or not, you don't have enough power to push that prop to proper revs.

Assuming the engine's in proper tune (developing the proper power), you could call ACME and say: "I've got this prop, and need to gain 1100 RPM, what do you recommend?" Don't even need to tell him it's an Epic or anything - he'd say something like, "well, you get 250 rpm per inch of pitch, so we'll drop you 4 inches, but you'll have to watch it when you come down from the mountains."

I'm not sure which prop turns faster, the one connected to a 1.25:1, or the 1.46:1. Basic question I can't answer. Might want to look at the tranny ratio too - not sure if they messed with that too.
Derek Boyer
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brad

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Re:New prop
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2004, 19:44:36 pm »
Got on the Deer Creek, Utah (6,500 + elevation) early this morning - boating in a cloud (the water was warmer than the air, thus the cloud rising from the lake effect).

Ran my 2002 SX up to 6,000 rpm's for the first time.  Only got a 29 mph reading (I'm using a 4 blade Nibral 13x13 LH.

I'm happy with the hole shot - must not have too much top end at this altitude?
Brad

2002 Epic SX

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Re:New prop
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2004, 20:32:04 pm »
Brad, you need to borrow/beg/steal a GPS. Cool that you got to 6K, though. And cool you got the boat out too!
Derek Boyer
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2000 Epic S22
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Bitzco

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Re:New prop
« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2004, 21:31:36 pm »
Very interesting. I'm going to Powell next week and will do some prop switching and GPS recording to see what difference the 13 X 13 and 13.5 X13 props make in speed and RPM.

I was up at Deer Creek Thursday. Air temp in the 60's and water not much better. Time to get the wet suits out.
03 Pilot, 01 Epic SX, 330 cc bombers and 4 kids in back. Working to retire to a lakeside cottage with my own boat dock.

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Re:New prop
« Reply #11 on: August 30, 2004, 15:19:15 pm »
I got my Epic 22 up to 38.9 @5900 with an OJ Nibral 4 blade yesterday, as measured via paddle wheel.
Pete

'01 Epic SX

brad

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Re:New prop
« Reply #12 on: September 18, 2004, 19:48:44 pm »
Okay, I begged and borrowed a GPS.  Did another reading at Deer Creek this morning (6,500 elevation).

Ran to 6,000 rpm's and got to 36.5 mph on the GPS - my speedometer still read 29 - using a 13X13 LH 4 blade.
Brad

2002 Epic SX

Bitzco

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Re:New prop
« Reply #13 on: September 18, 2004, 21:47:04 pm »
This sounds about like what Jaminhdds got on my GPS at powell on his S22 with the factory 13X13 four blade. with my SX and the 13X13.5 stainless four blade that was on it I could only get to 4900 rpm and about 32mph. A different prop was definitely needed. Too bad the prop, the boat and the GPS are now drowned. I didn't get the chance to switch to the 13X13 spare I had and check the numbers.
03 Pilot, 01 Epic SX, 330 cc bombers and 4 kids in back. Working to retire to a lakeside cottage with my own boat dock.

Bitzco

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Re: New prop
« Reply #14 on: June 08, 2005, 23:29:34 pm »
Capn' Rick,

Just wondering about the gear ratio in the S22 and SX22s and  thought you might know. With the same prop Festivus' S22 and my SX run at different speeds and different rpms. At most speeds, his rmps (S22) are about a thousand lower than my SX. This is with about the same weight in both boats. I asked about it at Marine products and they said it is probably because of the different ratios (1.25:1 vs 1.46:1. Do you think this is the reason? Why different ratios? and which boat has which ratio? The Marine Products guys thought some S22s had a bad ratio. They said they replaced two or three V-drives in S22s with the ratio that is in the SX. Any info would be nice if you have it. I assume the ratio would affect the prop I would want to put on my boat. I'm going to get an ACME and want all the info I can get before deciding which one. Like the VillageIdiot, I'm anal about these things.

Heh, heh, he said anal. Also, Festivus, the Marine Products guys said about $1700 total for the PP install.
03 Pilot, 01 Epic SX, 330 cc bombers and 4 kids in back. Working to retire to a lakeside cottage with my own boat dock.